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2/11/17 1:17 PM 
mindya
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(this post has been flagged as inappropriate, sorry.)

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2/11/17 1:25 PM 

isna_la_wica
Over 7,500 Posts!! (7,658)
Brantford, ON

Quote from bigd9832:
This is the tally of one of the preterists here, and how he has misrepresented the Scriptures and their meaning. This will always happen when you try to interpret the Bible without the Holy Spirit. I think it is a good idea to use this as an example of how not to study the Bible.


So lets see, how does he do it?

Oh yea, study one leader and memorize what they say. Holy Spirit is a memorization coach I guess ?

He really is no different than Lud. Just different sides of the same coin.

Only Lud claims all authority comes from a different source is all.But both claim its a heresy to disagree with them , even on a subject like prophecy.

The big Arrogant is listening in on the Holy Spirits conversations with Adolph I guess. But Adolph is sleeping. Maybe that voice he is hearing in his head is talking in Toungues?

He really needs to take his meds.




[Edited 2/11/2017 1:26:14 PM ]

2/11/17 1:42 PM 

ludlowlowell
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Isna, er, you and Bigd have something in common---you resort to personal insults.

True, he does it far more than you.


2/11/17 2:05 PM 

isna_la_wica
Over 7,500 Posts!! (7,658)
Brantford, ON

Quote from ludlowlowell:
Isna, er, you and Bigd have something in common---you resort to personal insults.

True, he does it far more than you.


And you do not?

I at least never told you that you were not a Christian. But you and bigD do that to all who are not the same as you.


2/11/17 2:19 PM 

ludlowlowell
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Those aren't personal insults.

Actually, what I said, or meant to say, is that no non-Catholic Christian is a true Christian beliver, because non-Catholic Christians leave so much out, and because outside the Church there is no salvation. Teachnically, non-Catholic Christians are Christians, if they have been baptized in the name of the Father, the Son, and Holy Spirit. The Catholic Church recognizes Protestant and Eastern Orthodox Baptisms as valid.

To say in general that such-and-such group of people are not true Christians is not personal in nature. Matthew 5:22 covers all personal insults, and is not a prohibition against the word "fool" only. "He really needs to take his meds" crosses the line into personal insult territory.

Let us disagree with each other in charity, when we disagree. Let us put forth the teaching or argument, and leave off the uncharitable personal remarks. I will say, Isna, that you make far fewer personal remarks than most people on these forums.




[Edited 2/11/2017 2:21:47 PM ]

2/11/17 2:22 PM 
mindya
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (23,621)
Vancouver, BC


Quote from ludlowlowell:
no non-Catholic Christian is a true Christian beliver,


That's an "uncharitable personal remark" in itself....

Neither you nor the RC church can make such a claim.


2/11/17 2:37 PM 

ludlowlowell
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That is not a personal remark, that is a remark in general. The Church does teach that, in extraordinary cases, non-Catholics can be saved without converting.

A personal insult would be me saying, Mindya, you're going to Hell, or Isna, you're going to Hell. Hey, you guys might make it to Heaven and me not! God might judge that you and Isna didn't know any better.

But to say in general that murdrrers, fornicators, idolators, schismatics, and heretics will go to Hell if they don't repent is not in any way making a personal insult. It's just a warning in general. When it comes to applying general principles to individual cases, all kinds of extenuating circumstances might be in existence.

An analogy: suppose a police officer addressed a high school class and said, "if you run with gangs, sooner or later you'll wind up in jail". That's a general statement and is usually true. But what if that officer pointed to someon who look scruffy and said, "You! You'll be in jail one day!" That would be ridiculous, unreasonable, and over the line.


2/11/17 5:33 PM 
mindya
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (23,621)
Vancouver, BC


(this post has been flagged as inappropriate, sorry.)

2/11/17 6:20 PM 
cupocheer
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (276,509)
Assumption, IL


"Quote from bigd9832:
This is the tally of one of the preterists here, and how he has misrepresented the Scriptures and their meaning. This will always happen when you try to interpret the Bible without the Holy Spirit. I think it is a good idea to use this as an example of how not to study the Bible."


hmmmm.... may I intrude?

Where in Bible scripture dies it state that the only way to understand the Bible's meaning is through Holy Spirit translation?

Isn't God, Himself, represented in the Bible as saying He will make all things known to those who seek Him?

So, doesn't that infer that ANYONE who seeks the word of God in the Bible is afforded a "translation" of understanding by God, Himself?

Further, how can ANYONE who seeks God do so through the translation of the Holy Spirit of one has not been given the understanding of the Holy Spirit by God, Himself?


2/11/17 6:52 PM 

isna_la_wica
Over 7,500 Posts!! (7,658)
Brantford, ON

Quote from cupocheer:
"Quote from bigd9832:
This is the tally of one of the preterists here, and how he has misrepresented the Scriptures and their meaning. This will always happen when you try to interpret the Bible without the Holy Spirit. I think it is a good idea to use this as an example of how not to study the Bible."


hmmmm.... may I intrude?

Where in Bible scripture dies it state that the only way to understand the Bible's meaning is through Holy Spirit translation?

Isn't God, Himself, represented in the Bible as saying He will make all things known to those who seek Him?

So, doesn't that infer that ANYONE who seeks the word of God in the Bible is afforded a "translation" of understanding by God, Himself?

Further, how can ANYONE who seeks God do so through the translation of the Holy Spirit of one has not been given the understanding of the Holy Spirit by God, Himself?


Good points.


2/11/17 7:34 PM 
cupocheer
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Thank you, but I don't credit for the truth expressed by the Bible.

2/11/17 11:21 PM 
cupocheer
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2/12/17 11:47 AM 
cupocheer
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2/13/17 4:35 PM 

isna_la_wica
Over 7,500 Posts!! (7,658)
Brantford, ON

Quote from mindya:
That's an "uncharitable personal remark" in itself....

Neither you nor the RC church can make such a claim.


Oh, he has that covered by confession.

You and I though? Man are we ever doomed!

I will have to pay for the time I lied to my Mom in grade 2 and I said my home work was done so I could play Hockey! And wow, the list from my puberty years, lol, those darn mini skirts came out the same time.

Its hilarious really, all these Christians with their tuner car mentality . Stock Christianity is not enough, they add all these buts to their Salvation.

It was good enough for Paul.

2 Corinthians 12:9

New International Version
But he said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness." Therefore I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses, so that Christ's power may rest on me.

That is the stock version.

But some like Lud, insist stock version is not good enough. You have to add a blower or Turbo, in the form of rituals, and high test petrol which is like approved wine.

Then you have bigD, saying that people that disagree with him cannot hear the spirit, so there fore must not be Christian. That is like adding "onstar" I figure, stuck in German mode, "Bitte geben Sie Ihren Standort an." over and over and over again.

Or the Pentecostals who claim, one must add toungues. That is like a boom box playing rap.

SDA say one must add visions to the gospel, that is like adding the latest screen.

Problem is, adding all the junk you want to a Kia, ain`t going to beat the most basic little Caterham 7 in stock form.

I should not pick on Kia I guess. LOL, will have to think what Car best represents each one. Never thought of that before.




[Edited 2/13/2017 4:36:31 PM ]

2/13/17 4:50 PM 
cupocheer
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (276,509)
Assumption, IL


"quote isnalawica
Or the Pentecostals who claim, one must add

toungues TONGUES.

That is like a boom box playing rap."

See, ISNA, just like I just posted in own thread "no you didn't" --- you tell I'm yourself --- you do this habitually, no matter which alternate profile you are posting with. [I won't post all your alternate profile nicknames here, but we both know I'm telling it like it is, don't we?]


BTW, ISNA -- All Pentacostals DO NOT say ANY born again Christian must receive ANY of God's gifts, including tongues, to be a saved Christian. You need to check your facts. And while you ate checking that, you need to check the different Pentecostal denominations because they don't all believe the same, either.


2/13/17 4:55 PM 

isna_la_wica
Over 7,500 Posts!! (7,658)
Brantford, ON

Quote from cupocheer:
"quote isnalawica
Or the Pentecostals who claim, one must add

toungues TONGUES.

That is like a boom box playing rap."

See, ISNA, just like I just posted in own thread "no you didn't" --- you tell I'm yourself --- you do this habitually, no matter which alternate profile you are posting with. [I won't post all your alternate profile nicknames here, but we both know I'm telling it like it is, don't we?]


BTW, ISNA -- All Pentacostals DO NOT say ANY born again Christian must receive ANY of God's gifts, including tongues, to be a saved Christian. You need to check your facts. And while you ate checking that, you need to check the different Pentecostal denominations because they don't all believe the same, either.


You are daft,.

I do not have multiple profiles,

Better take yer meds.


2/13/17 5:10 PM 

isna_la_wica
Over 7,500 Posts!! (7,658)
Brantford, ON

Sorry Mac, just got heated, she claimed on her thread I was some poster from California named cactus.

Went to flag her post, but it had disappeared.

=================================================================================


2/13/17 5:18 PM 

ludlowlowell
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Panama City, FL
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Speaking in tongues? Anybody can go jibber-jabber-jibber.

2/13/17 5:26 PM 

isna_la_wica
Over 7,500 Posts!! (7,658)
Brantford, ON

Quote from ludlowlowell:
Speaking in tongues? Anybody can go jibber-jabber-jibber.


One thing we agree on.


2/13/17 5:54 PM 
mindya
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (23,621)
Vancouver, BC


Quote from isna_la_wica:
Sorry Mac, just got heated, she claimed on her thread I was some poster from California named cactus.

Went to flag her post, but it had disappeared.

=================================================================================


I just looked at the profile "cactus" - there are no posts associated with it.


2/13/17 6:17 PM 

isna_la_wica
Over 7,500 Posts!! (7,658)
Brantford, ON

Quote from mindya:
I just looked at the profile "cactus" - there are no posts associated with it.


This one?


From: Location: Hesperia, California

Yes, no posts and no discussions, yet cup is claiming it is me and I post under that name.

Unless there is another.

All because of the way I spell Toungues.

I wonder how she knows how cactus spells it? If you read the profile, mmmmmm.




Guess this is a new one to add to your list on this thread.

Along with accuse people of being an alcoholic, lol.


2/13/17 6:39 PM 
mindya
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (23,621)
Vancouver, BC


Quote from isna_la_wica:
This one?


From: Location: Hesperia, California

Yes, no posts and no discussions, yet cup is claiming it is me and I post under that name.

Unless there is another.

All because of the way I spell Toungues.

I wonder how she knows how cactus spells it? If you read the profile, mmmmmm.




Guess this is a new one to add to your list on this thread.

Along with accuse people of being an alcoholic, lol.


Yep, that's the profile - never seen it before.

Tounges is a common spelling error...


2/13/17 7:36 PM 
cupocheer
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (276,509)
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(this post has been flagged as inappropriate, sorry.)

5/30/17 8:55 AM 
cupocheer
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6/5/17 4:29 AM 
brashdoc
Over 2,000 Posts (3,360)
Chehalis, WA

bumpety bump

6/5/17 1:06 PM 

ludlowlowell
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"How can you tell if someone is filled with the Holy Spirit? By how much they love the Catholic Church."

--St. Augustine


6/5/17 5:16 PM 
cupocheer
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (276,509)
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Quote from ludlowlowell:
Speaking in tongues? Anybody can go jibber-jabber-jibber.


LUD, do you believe in the New Testament record of Jesus' ministry?


6/5/17 5:56 PM 
brashdoc
Over 2,000 Posts (3,360)
Chehalis, WA

How can you tell if someone if filled with the Holy Spirit besides hearing one man's opinion & private interpretation devoid of Scripture?

Scripture, which is THE TRUTH. Always nice to hear the actual truth.



Eph 4:1-3 As a prisoner for the Lord, then, I urge you to live a life worthy of the calling you have received. Be completely humble and gentle; be patient, bearing with one another in love. Make every effort to keep the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace.

Eph 5:15-21 Be very careful, then, how you live—not as unwise but as wise, making the most of every opportunity, because the days are evil. Therefore do not be foolish, but understand what the Lord’s will is. Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to debauchery. Instead, be filled with the Spirit, speaking to one another with psalms, hymns & songs from the Spirit. Sing & make music from your heart to the Lord, always giving thanks to God the Father for everything, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. Submit to one another out of reverence for Christ.

Gal 5:12-26 You, my brothers and sisters, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the flesh ; rather, serve one another humbly in love. For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.

So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whateverc you want. 18But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

19The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry & witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions & envy; drunkenness, orgies & the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness & self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. Let us NOT become conceited, provoking & envying each other.


6/5/17 11:30 PM 

ludlowlowell
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Quite rightly do you quote this, Doc. And quite rightly do you read Polycarp and other early Christian writers. You should read a little into Martin Luther's writings, and see how far different they are to what Paul is saying here. Paul admonishes us not to use our Christian freedom to indulge the flesh; Luther taught that we could sin with impunity.

6/6/17 6:47 AM 
cupocheer
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (276,509)
Assumption, IL


.
Quote from cupocheer:
LUD, do you believe in the New Testament record of Jesus' ministry?


6/6/17 6:32 PM 

ludlowlowell
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You do enjoy changing the subject, don't you Cup.

6/6/17 7:31 PM 
cupocheer
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I didn't change the subject, LUD. I expounded on your post. You enjoy avoiding responding, don't you, LUD?

6/7/17 2:39 AM 
brashdoc
Over 2,000 Posts (3,360)
Chehalis, WA

I already addressed the issue of you, Lud, falsely slandering Martin Luther and falsely quoting him--out of context, only quoting part of what he said & thus grossly changing what Luther actually meant by what he FULLY said.

And by the way I grew up Lutheran, studying Luther & went through Lutheran catechism & Luther never despised the 10 commandments BUT TAUGHT THEM. That was part of my catechism! Since you refuse to address these issues honestly, no further discussion is necessary nor can any honest & meaningful dialogue occur.


6/7/17 9:04 AM 

ludlowlowell
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"If anyone should still believe in the ten commandments, let him chase himself to the Jews."

--Martin Luther

Brashdoc, you impress me as being a sincere person and as a person who does research. Do some research on Martin Luther, what he really taught, what he really stood for. Did you know that Luther taught absolute predestinationism, that no one has a choice, that God predestines some but not others?


6/7/17 9:18 AM 
cupocheer
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (276,509)
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Quote from ludlowlowell:
"If anyone should still believe in the ten commandments, let him chase himself to the Jews."

--Martin Luther

Brashdoc, you impress me as being a sincere person and as a person who does research. Do some research on Martin Luther, what he really taught, what he really stood for. Did you know that Luther taught absolute predestinationism, that no one has a choice, that God predestines some but not others?


Didn't God, Himself, pre-destined that concept, LUD?


6/7/17 12:06 PM 

ludlowlowell
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God certainly did not, Cup. God may lead us but we make the choice ourselves.

6/7/17 2:44 PM 
cupocheer
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LUD, humans having the choice was not an actuality without God's condoning that capability, correct?

6/7/17 5:30 PM 

ludlowlowell
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You're trying to play a word game, here, Cup, and I won't let you. The Catholic Church has always taught, anient, medieval, and modern, that Hod gave man a choice. Martin Luther and John Calvin taught that man has no choice.

6/7/17 5:33 PM 
cupocheer
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Lud, how can another human being tell me that if I accept Jesus Christ I shall have eternal salvation?

6/7/17 6:00 PM 

ludlowlowell
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When you use the phrase "if I accept the Lord Jesus Christ" you say very clearly that you think you have a choice in the matter. And you are right, you do. And the Catholic Church agrees with you.

Martin Luther and John Calvin disagreed. Both taught absolute predestinationism, that man has no choice.




[Edited 6/7/2017 6:01:19 PM ]

6/7/17 7:38 PM 
cupocheer
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You may choose Jesus Christ.

I have chosen Jesus Christ.

So we both have a choice.

Martin Luther was a protestant.

Protestants taught me Jesus' biblical lessons and those lessons include choice.

I am a protestant.

You fault Martin Luther for the New Testament version of The Bible because he disagreed with the false teachings of the RCC or because his teaching of Jesus'promises teaching gave me a choice of acceptance?

You can't have it both ways (damn, I almost called you Trump) LUD.


6/7/17 10:14 PM 

ludlowlowell
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Glad to see that you agree with the Catholic Church and not Martin Luther on this one.

6/8/17 5:27 AM 
cupocheer
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LUD, let's make this quite clear -- I agree with Jesus Christ and the word of God. Amen

6/8/17 8:57 AM 

ludlowlowell
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Quote from cupocheer:
LUD, let's make this quite clear -- I agree with Jesus Christ and the word of God. Amen


Good. All I ask of you, Brashdoc, or anyone other Christian is that they read up on Martin Luther and find out what kind of scoundrel this guy really was, and the absurd and unchristian things he said, did, and taught.




[Edited 6/8/2017 8:57:34 AM ]

6/8/17 11:20 AM 
cupocheer
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You may ask anything, LUD. It doesn't mean anyone need comply with your suggestion.

Your opinion is yours; thank you for expressing your opinion.


6/8/17 3:28 PM 
mindya
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (23,621)
Vancouver, BC


Quote from mindya:
We've seen this approach many times by various groups and persons over the centuries when trying to "defeat" an opposing position or interpretation on the bible:

Quote from bigd9832:
This is the tally of one of the preterists here, and how he has misrepresented the Scriptures and their meaning. This will always happen when you try to interpret the Bible without the Holy Spirit. I think it is a good idea to use this as an example of how not to study the Bible.


Shades of the Greek Inquisition again..



Losing the argument while claiming you have the holy spirit and you're opponent has not is just another form of the "appeal to authority" fallacy and blowing your own trumpet:





Quote from bigd9832:
You have been warned.






Repost to thwart the flagger...


6/9/17 1:46 PM 
cupocheer
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Who is flagging, Mindya?

I just read my own blog recently and someone is accusing me of flagging someone. They are lying, of course, but it is still a childish game these idiots participate in.

The last time the flag hags went on a rampage they accuse everybody else of doing the flagging when they were the ones doing the flagging -- even to themselves.

So repititious, year-after-year.


6/19/17 12:38 PM 
mindya
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They know...

6/19/17 10:44 PM 
cupocheer
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I know they do.

6/21/17 6:33 AM 
cupocheer
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8/14/17 11:22 AM 

isna_la_wica
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Quote from mindya:
Repost to thwart the flagger...



lol


8/15/17 6:58 AM 
cupocheer
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(this post has been flagged as inappropriate, sorry.)

10/18/17 7:15 AM 
cupocheer
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